Thursday 29th March 2001
Present:
CERN: J Apostolakis (Chairman), G Cosmo, G Folger, Jürgen Knobloch, M Maire, M G Pia, F Ranjard, S Sadilov, M Schroder, P Truscott (Secretary), L Urban, J-P Wellisch
KEK: K Amako, T Sasaki (before 11:00 CET)
University of Manchester: J Allison
University of Naruto (telephone): H Yoshida
Santender: P Arce
SLAC: W Lockman (part-time), D Wright
TRIUMF: P Gumplinger
Apologies for absence:
M Verderi (Ecole Polytechnique)
Minutes of the last meeting
Comments had been submitted by M G Pia as corrections to the minutes of the meeting of 25th January 2001, however these remained to be incorporated. Subject to these corrections, the minutes of the meeting (currently at version 1.1) were accepted.
A request was made (F Ranjard, P Truscott) for future minutes to be shorter and reflect only the conclusions (rather than the detail) of the discussions.
Actions from previous meetings
Actions from TSB Meetings 9 and 10 were reviewed (see Annex A for Action List).
Collaboration Board Meeting
A collaboration board meeting was held in Paris on 12th February 2001. Key points of discussion were the Geant4 licence, disclaimer of warranty and milestones for the past year.
Licence
The CB had proposesd to circulate a letter to copyright holders and ask whether they would accept Geant4 release under public release, GNU Public Licence (GPL) or have a prefered some other form of licence. This letter remains to be drafted.
Disclaimer
The CB has drafted and circulated (for comment) a disclaimer for warranty. However, a response is being awaited from some institutes. The current time-scales prohibit the planned inclusion of a warranty disclaimer in the next (minor release), and it was considered essential to have one by the late June 29th release of Geant4.
Action 11.1
J Apostolakis to draft a letter to the CB expressing concern for the lack of an approved disclaimer of warranty, and recommend to the CB that wording for a disclaimer be finalised by 1st June 2001.
Milestones
It is anticipated that the final papers on the Comparisons Project will be completed in Summer (July to September 2001).
The draft report covering the software process milestone will be sent to the CB at the end of this week (any comments should be forwarded to G Cosmo).
The CB has accepted the training kit milestone as fulfilled. It was reported that the CB had identified(The TSB chair noted the need to make the training kits more accessible on the web-site, and state that they’re primarily intended for use by in lectures by people with Geant4 expertise.)
New members
The CB had received two proposals for new members from universities at Helsinki and Barcelona. A final decision has not been reached by the CB. The TSB strongly encourage a decision to be taken soon, in order for the collaboration to meet programme deadlines. TSB eagerly looks forward to a decision.
Category coordinators meeting
Notes from the category coordinators meeting have been published at the Geant4 web-site and were circulated and discussed at the TSB.
Publications and reports
General paper
J Allison reported on the status of the General Paper. The timetable is currently:
- 4th April - Second draft contributions submitted
- 11th April – Editors required to provide feedback
- 24th April – Third consolidated draft
- 3rd May – Final draft
The general comments about the first draft are:
- It is somewhat repetitious showing sections to have been written in isolation;
- There is a need to consider the target audience, which will influence the content and style;
- Wherever possible, concrete examples to showcase Geant4 should be introduced;
- The first three chapters should provide an overview and background, whilst the subsequent chapters should provide the detail.
J Knobloch asked whether copies of the sections could be provided in PostScript and/or PDF format. This was agreed
Action 11.2
J Allison to arrange for PostScript and/or PDF versions of sections to be available.
J Apostolakis emphasised that the paper should be strong on the design and structure of Geant4 (which is a topic that was unlikely to be covered in similar detail in future publications). He also requested contributions covering Chapter 8, and in particular, if members of the collaboration were writing other papers on Geant4 applications, to provide1-2 paragraph summaries should be sent to him. Similarly, contributions were invited from those who had or would be conducting extensive runs of Geant4, which would reveal the robustness of Geant4.
Action 11.3
Where appropriate all collaboration members to submit summary information about "applications" papers and/or information relating to Geant4 robustness to J Apostolakis.
J Apostolakis stated that there was the potential for duplication between the "comparisons" subsection of Chapter 8 and comparisons with experiment in Chapter 5 (Processes). It was agreed that it was still valuable to have the subsection in Chapter 8, since it would cover the methodology for comparisons and present results where there are several combined processes involved.
The following alterations to the organisation of the paper were agreed:
- There would be a geometry subsection, and a material and particle subsection in Chapter 2.
- Handling of stack track and pile-up should be discussed.
- The last subsection in Chapter 2 should be removed and Chapter 8 should discuss how to build a Geant4 simulation.
Nuclear Instruments and Methods in Physical Science (NIM) was identified as the preferred target journal for the General Paper, whilst Computer Physics Communications was a possible alternative if the paper was not accepted by NIM.
MG Pia requested noted that the results from experiments or other groups on comparisons between data and simulation should be referenced from published papers, since the Geant4 Collaboration could not publish somebody else's data (unless properly referenced). J Apostolakis commented that approval to publish data from experiments has been acquired or was currently being would be sought, wherever required.
Activity report
Although the majority of the contributions are present, the Activity Report is not in as advanced state as was hoped.
Action 11.4
Category coordinators to provide first draft of contribution to Activity Report to J Apostolakis by 30th March or discuss revised time-scales.
Action 11.5
J Apostolakis to issue a status report on the Activity Report.
It is intended that the editors will generate feedback on the draft Activity Report in the first two weeks in April.
Plans for release in 2001
At the Category Coordinators meeting the following time-scales for Geant4 release were agreed:
- Geant4 3.1 – 6th April 2001. This release is intended to be Minor release, between scheduled releases.
- Geant4 3.2 or 4.0 – 29th June 2001 (release period to start 18th May, with subsequent release deadlines 25th May and 1st June). This release shall include a disclaimer of warranty. The status (major or minor) will be confirmed closer to the date.
- Geant4 4.0 or 5.0 – 14th December 2001. It is anticipated that this will be a major release, and there will be experiments dependent upon changes to the toolkit in this release.
A discussion was held as to whether it should be possible to change the behaviour of classes of Geant4 for minor releases, where traditionally only bug-fixes are permitted. Associated with this issue is the need to (and complication of) distinguishing between bug-fix tags and development tags, potentially using a flag for cases where a bug-fix had been made. There is also the need for supporting branches in the development process and the associated manpower overhead of having to effect changes to two (or more) versions. It was agreed that a concrete procedure should be developed on how to effect such modifications in minor releases, and this should be presented and discussed at the next workshop.
Action 11.6
G Cosmo to develop a procedure for Geant4 minor releases which includes minor changes in Geant4 behaviour.
It was agreed that it should be possible to update the documentation for any scheduled release, whether major or minor.
Action 11.7
K Amako to create a procedure for updating documentation at any scheduled release, and promulgate procedure to category coordinators.
Supported platforms
G Folger presented the results of the survey of user platforms of Geant4 parties. The most popular configurations are PC/Linux and Sun/Solaris. There is however a modest-size DEC user community and a requirement for PC Windows systems. INFN require support for the next 1-2 years for DEC, but ultimately may dispose of DEC machines thereafter. The GLAST collaboratortion requires/ operates its applications software on Windows 2000 and Visual C++, as a result of collaborations with NASA. In addition, LHCb required Geant4 operation on Windows/NT. IN2P3 is also a DEC/Geant4 user, as is SLAC, which uses Geant4 with ObjectSpace STL..
With the anticipated disposal shutdown of DEC and HP machines at CERN by the end of 2002, it was agreed that partners with particular platform requirements should share the responsibility for porting and full system testing.
Action 11.8
IN2P3, UK User Group, SLAC to investigate whether hardware and manpower could be made available at their establishments for testing Geant4 on DEC. F Ranjard to investigate whether similar facilities can be made available for PC Windows machines.
The process of how testing and modification should be undertaken remains to be decided:
- Category groups could be allowed access to the machines to debug software;
- Feedback could be provided by the testing team of bugs and bug-fixes, and the category coordinators assess and approve the fix.
Concern was raised about the potential additional workload on the Category Coordinators, especially considering the limited human resources presently available.
Following discussion it was proposed to discontinue testing and support of Geant4 on HP platforms after at the next scheduled release after the June 2001 release. The release of December 2001 will not be supported on HP.
, and possibly discontinue teTesting on DEC machines would continue at CERN until at the end of the year at least. The site to which testing of DEC will migrate during 2002 must be identified.
It was agreed that coding standards will continue to be followed to ensure that, if at all possible, no action would be taken to deliberately or otherwise preclude any particular platform that is not specifically supported.
Action 11.9
Software Management Working Group to distribute a circular to determine requirement for support to duplicate Sun compilers, and if appropriate (i.e. subject to response and decision of the TSB), discontinue support to Sun CC 4.2.
Action 11.10
J Apostolakis to issue an announcement on plans for discontinuing/modifying support for HP and DEC platforms.
Milestones for 2001
Individual objectives for working groups
J Apostolakis stated that he was yet to receive a complete set of objectives from all working groups.
Action 11.11
J Apostolakis to liase with individual working group members coordinators on milestones for 2001, and generate a list of working group objectives by the end of next week. It is intended that the Working Group goals should then be discussed at the next TSB.
Architecture Paper
It was agreed that the paper covering the architecture of Geant4 will be written by a task of the Architecture working group when it if formed.
Evolution of training kits and documentation
It is anticipated that activities for development of the training kits this year could would include:
- Speakers’ notes to explain figures and schemes where general knowledge was insufficient.
- A video or recorded audio lesson synchronised with slide projector (this was an informal objective since no particular partner had requested this).
- Improved tools for maintaining training kits and exercises.
- Improved infrastructure for developing documentation, and increased linkages between different parts of the documentation.
A video or recorded audio lesson synchronised with slide projector was agreed as an optional objective.
It was agreed to forward to the CB a job description for a person to work on the structure of the training kits, the Web and the user documentation and potentially on tools to integrate some of their aspects - in order to ease in their maintenance.
A target of October 2001 was set for a review of the Geant4 user documentation.
Action 11.12
K Amako to send plan for review of documentation system (from Workshop in October 2000), in order to get feedback from TSB members.
Comparison projects and new applications
One of the objectives of 2001 will be to explore new comparison projects, especially those which that will stress the areas of physics which have no't been tested significantly up to now in comparison projects. Proposals were invited from the member groups on these, as well as new applications, but it was stressed that the timescales for conducting this exercise should be realistic to ensure that reasonable milestones are identified.
Action 11.13
Member groups to provide proposals on new comparison projects and new applications to the TSB, which will identify agree potential milestones.
Regression suite
The intention of the regression suite is to minimise the manual work required for base-lining outputs from comparisons used to assess the impact of changes on performance. The Processes Groups were invited to identify concrete examples which would be used for the suite, and to assess the magnitude of the task to implement these into the suite. To kick this activity off, J Apostolakis agreed to define better the requirements from the processes groups in order to support the development of the suite.
The need to create an infrastructure for the creation of the regression suite was noted. Resources to achieve theseis sub-objectives will be discussed at a later TSB.
Action 11.14
J Apostolakis to issue a memo on the requirements from processes groups.
New requirements
The requirement for specifying the lifetime for each instance of the B-meson was understood, and code modifications have been implemented and were in the process of being tested.
There was aA new requirement for Geant4 to handle "optical" processes of X-rays was expressed on behalf of ESA.
Action 11.15
MG Pia to provide the TSB with a more detailed description of requirements for treating specular reflection processes of X-rays.
HyperNews Public Forum
It was requested the HyperNews system cover the following fora: General matters; Experimental setup; Physics; Control of runs, events, tracks, particles; Interfaces. There was concern that over the amount of work required for dealing with HyperNews queries could become problematic.
Software process
The requirement for traceability from user requirements to the design, implementation and tests was discussed at the category coordinators meeting. It was anticipated that one month of effort could be required for some cases to complete this task. Category coordinators were invited to submit estimates of the effort required for their specific categories.
Action 11.16
Category coordinators to submit estimates of manpower and time-scales for implementing traceability. Category coordinators were also requested to provide updates to designs, particularly architectural design diagrams. Deadline – 20th April (May for the Hadronics category).
(This action is not relevant to the lowE EM Working Group, which has completed the software traceability task.)
Architecture subgroup of category coordinators
J Apostolakis reviewed the terms of reference of the Architecture subgroup:
- The subgroup will be responsible for maintaining the global category diagram and the Geant4 URD;
- It would bring recommendations for updates, proposed by category coordinators, to the TSB;
- It will be responsible for producing the Geant4 Architecture paper (deadline Autumn 2001).
J Apostolakis stated that he wouldproposed to announce the membership of the subgroup by the end of the month once it had been finalised.
Geant4 Workshop 2001
The date of the Geant4 Workshop in Genova was confirmed as 2nd – 6th July. The current members of the programme committee were MG Pia and M Schroder. It was requested that a relatively good draft of the programme be produced and circulated by the end of April.
Action 11.17
M G Pia / M Schroder to issue a draft Workshop programme before the end of April.
Dates for next meetings
The following dates were identified for subsequent TSB meetings:
- End of May to mid June
- End of September to mid October
- Mid to late October
Action 11.18
J Apostolakis to circulate a list of more specific TSB dates to members and finalise these dates.
Any other business
New members
An application of three students (Elena Guradincerri, Simeone Dussoni and Alfonso Mantero) made by M G Pia was discussed by the TSB. No objections were raised to their joining the Geant4 collaboration as part of the Low-Energy Electromagnetic Physics WG.
Similarly the applications of Dr Kouiti Murakami (Kyoto University), and Rachid Marzini (a PhD student at the University of Montreal) were accepted (subject to CB approval). It is intended that K Murakami join the collaboration as part of the UI working group.
Monitoring of Geant4 downloads
A proposal for monitoring Geant4 downloads from the web-site was discussed. It was decided that some explanation would be required on the user registration page as to why details were being collected, and how they would be used. E-mail details of the user should be optional (e.g. if they wanted to submit their name to a mailing list).
The establishment of this facility was generally supported, subject to the availability of resources.
Action 11.19
G Folger to provide an estimate of the resources required to establish a facility to collect user information when downloading from the Geant4 web-site
Planned ESA ITT
It was reported that ESA plan to issue an ITT covering the requirements and development of radiation tools (expected to be based on Geant4) in support of ESA science missions. Proposals will be invited and subject to open competition for a prime contractor (with 60% of the 400kEuro budget) to run the programme of work. Part of that programme will involve smaller Announcements of Opportunity (envisaged to cost 10-50 kEuro each) for research groups to undertake specific studies.
Annex A: Action List
Actions from TSB Meeting 9 (20th October 2000)
Action 9.1
J Apostolakis
Action complete
Action 9.2
G Cosmo to update the release procedure to include a regular review of the Category Diagram.
Action complete
Action 9.3
G Cosmo to review the URD and create a plan for updating it, potentially creating a set of top-level URDs for detailed requirements.
Action continuing?
Action 9.4
G Cosmo to create a repository for storing results and raw data of the software assessment.
Action complete
Action 9.5
G Folger / S Sadilov to plan for minor release or patch to update Geant4 3.0 to support shared libraries on Linux and Solaris, and to update system testing to test this configuration.
It is anticipated that support to shared libraries for Linux and Solaris will be in the 6th June minor release. System testing is now starting to test this. Pending successful testing, these will be available in the repository for use next week.
Action continuing
Action 9.6
M Asai to support the HepMC event generator interface.
This is partially satisfied.
Action continuing
Action 9.7
M Asai to respond to request for facility to specify lifetime for each instance of the B-meson.
At the category coordinators meeting, H Kurashige was reported to have said that modification to meet this requirement was implemented and is being tested.
Action continuing
Action 9.8
H Kurashige / M Maire to investigate methods of reducing Geant4 initialisation time.
This involves saving of the User Physics List. At the category coordinators meeting, H Kurashige was reported to have said that this is dependent upon how the facility set up by category would be used.
Action continuing
Action 9.9
G Folger to ask institutions (experiment, institute, laboratory) representatives which platforms are in substantial use amongst its members for geant4 simulations.
G Folger had compiled a list of the responses (discussed later at this meeting).
Action complete
Action 9.10
Software Management Team to provide results of Solaris 7.1 / CC++ 5.1 certification for Geant4.
Action complete
Actions from TSB Meeting 10 (25th January 2001)
Action 10.1
Working Group Coordinators
Status?
Action 10.2
?? to generate and maintain a full list of goals for 2001 for each working group, including development, testing and support. This should identify completion times for intermediate checkpoints. The first version should be available February 28th, 2001.
Status?
Action 10.3
M Asai to create a half-page summary on the objectives of the papers on the architecture of Geant4 and the software process, and to find an editor for the architecture paper.
Status?
Action 10.4
J Apostolakis, M Asai and working group coordinators to prepare a detailed proposal on a regression suite for Geant4 (discussed later at this meeting).
Status?
New Actions from TSB Meeting 11 (29th March 2001)
Action 11.1
J Apostolakis
Action 11.2
J Allison to arrange for PostScript and/or PDF versions of sectionsthe general paper to be available.
Action 11.3
Where appropriate all collaboration members to submit summary information about "applications" papers and/or information relating to Geant4 robustness to J Apostolakis.
Action 11.4
Category coordinators to provide first draft of contribution to Activity Report to J Apostolakis by 30th March or discuss revised time-scales.
Action 11.5
J Apostolakis to issue a status report on the Activity Report.
Action 11.6
G Cosmo to develop a procedure for Geant4 minor releases which includes minor changes in Geant4 behaviour.
Action 11.7
K Amako to create a procedure for updating documentation at any scheduled release, and promulgate communicate procedure to category coordinators.
Action 11.8
IN2P3, UK User Group, SLAC to investigate whether hardware and manpower could be made available at their establishments for testing Geant4 on DEC. F Ranjard to investigate whether similar facilities can be made available for PC Windows machines.
Action 11.9
Software Management Working Group to distribute a circular to determine requirement for support to duplicate Sun compilers, and if appropriate (i.e. subject to response and decision of the TSB), discontinue support to Sun CC 4.2.
Action 11.10
J Apostolakis to issue an announcement on plans for discontinuing/modifying support for HP and DEC platforms.
Action 11.11
J Apostolakis to liase with individual working group members on milestones for 2001, and generate a list of working group objectives by the end of next week. It is intended that the Working Group goals should then be discussed at the next TSB.
Action 11.12
K Amako to send plan for review of documentation system (from Workshop in October 2000), in order to get feedback from TSB members.
Action 11.13
Member groups to provide proposals on new comparison projects and new application areass to identify potential milestones.
Action 11.14
J Apostolakis to issue a memo on the requirements for regression testing from processes groups.
Action 11.15
MG Pia to provide the TSB with a more detailed description of requirements for treating specular reflection processes of X-rays.
Action 11.16
Category coordinators to submit estimates of manpower and time-scales for implementing traceability. Category coordinators were also requested to provide updates to designs, particularly architectural design diagrams. Deadline – 20th April (May for the Hadronics category). (This action is not relevant to the lowE EM Working Group, which has completed the software traceability task.)
Action 11.17
M G Pia / M Schroder to issue a draft Workshop programme before the end of April.
Action 11.18
J Apostolakis to circulate a list of more specific TSB dates to members and finalise these dates.
Action 11.19
G Folger to provide an estimate of the resources required to establish a facility to collect user information when downloading from the Geant4 web-site